# User talk:Notjusttired

## New theory of CFS

Hi. I have a new theory of CFS. I'm not sure this is the best forum, but I'd love it if you'd take a look.

Thanks! -Tom

## Leave me a message

Could you explain what you are doing to the fatty acid and the antibody pages? You are removing important links that are there to remind us that we need to create these pages. Red links help us to figure out which important pages need to be created, such as the fatty acid and the antibody pages. By removing important red links, we lose track of which pages need to be created. All your changes will need to be reverted when the pages are created. If you are looking to simplify things, then we can get rid of the categories, rather than the main pages for the categories. In this case, we would combine all pages in the category into the main page for the category, so that we have one page, rather than a whole category. Please explain.
Pyrrhus (talk) 00:29, October 11, 2019 (EDT)

I already discussed this with User:Kmdenmark as I think you've already seen Talk:Single_nucleotide_polymorphism here - others you tagged earlier did not respond. Those pages won't have enough content to be worthwhile do terms are now added to the glossary. They have been stub pages for many years rather than wanted pages - I have looked for content and there is simply too little to justify a page. Fatty acids is a category that does not need a summary article in my view, plus there are articles for very long chain fatty acids, short chain fatty acids, etc. Please think carefully about making mass reverts without checking. User:Pyrrhus ~Njt (talk) 09:26, October 11, 2019 (EDT)

Messages I've seen:

content hidden

Hi Njt! I just wanted to briefly clarify what I said on Kmdenmark's talk page. I'll use bullet points because I find it easier to organize my thoughts:

• There are three different language settings in MediaWiki:
• The wiki's default language setting (specified in LocalSettings.php)
• The page's content language setting (reflected by the language code suffix such as "/de")
• The reader's preferred language setting (specified in preferences, for now)
• The visible screen in MediaWiki is divided into user interface and content.
• The user interface should always match the reader's preferred language setting.
• The content should always match the page's content language setting.
• Now, template messages mostly count as user interface, not as content, so templates mostly follow the reader's preferred language, not the page's content language. This is why templates use {{int:}} or {{int:lang}}, since these parser functions follow the reader's preferred language, not the page's content language.
• However, when you're editing content inside a regular page, your content should follow the page's content language. In this case, you should use {{PAGELANGUAGE}}, not {{int:}}. Of course, since each language gets their own page via a suffix like "/de", you probably won't need to use either.
• Example: Template:Cleanup displays a message about the page at the top of the page. This is best considered part of the user interface, not part of the page itself. Therefore, this template will follow the reader's preferred language and use {{int:}}, not {{PAGELANGUAGE}}.
• Example: Glossary/de is a content page. Therefore anything added to this page should follow the page's content language, not the reader's preferred language. To put it another way, the content of a page ending in "/de" should be in German, no matter what the reader's preferred language is.
• More complicated example: Template:Citation needed displays a message embedded inside the content of a page. Does this make it part of the user interface or part of the page content itself? If we consider it part of the user interface, then it should use {{int:lang}}. However, if we consider it part of the page content then it should use {{PAGELANGUAGE}} instead of {{int:lang}}. This is kind of a grey area, but the more I think about it, it should probably be considered part of the content, not part of the user interface. Therefore, we should consider switching it from {{int:lang}} to {{PAGELANGUAGE}}.
• NOTE: {{PAGELANGUAGE}} does not yet work, as it needs a developer change in order to make sure that it returns the same language as the "/de" suffix.

Hope this is clear!
Pyrrhus (talk) 00:04, September 7, 2019 (EDT)

Thanks for the great explanation. Does PAGELANGUAGE use system messages? I guess having a main page in different languages would probably be too much to maintain? Although if it was possible to create them using system messages it might be simple since the page doesn't change often. Do you know if the word Portal is translated in the user interface? I think it might not be. A more recent developer tasks list would be appreciated on Slack since I am not sure if we have requested certain things or not. notjusttired (talk) 09:23, September 7, 2019 (EDT)
PAGELANGUAGE is just a global system variable that returns the page content language of the current page. I don’t think having the main page in different languages will be such a big deal, it’s short and it doesn’t change much. Plus, you don’t need admin privileges to create Welcome to MEpedia/de, like you would need in order to create a system message. But more importantly, if someone chooses to view the German version of the main page using the interlanguage links in the sidebar, then they should expect to see the page in German, not in whatever their reader preferred language setting might be at the time, which is why system messages are to be avoided in a content page. This will all probably become much clearer when the developer changes are made and we can test things out for ourselves. I’ll send you a link on Slack to the “DRAFT Developer Suggestions” as it currently stands. Hope this helps.
Pyrrhus (talk) 20:41, September 7, 2019 (EDT)
Great! My thinking with system messages was to use without int:, eg MediaWiki:mymessage/{{PAGELANGUAGE}} notjusttired (talk) 15:51, September 8, 2019 (EDT)

## Category banners: Medical hypotheses and Potential treatments

content hidden

Compatibility with all skins

Both the pivot and Timeless (dark) skins rely on classes being used - without that no banner appears on the Pivot skin and the colors are messed up on Timeless skin (it adds a dark shadow to text to improve contrast: it's also a "low vision" skin). Current banners are created by MediaWiki:Common.js Javascript using the following classes and css (note: banner position can be moved below heading if "append" is used instead of "prepend").

//$(".mw-body-content").css ("background-color","#f8d6c2"); //$(".toc").css ("background-color","#f8d6c2");
(".firstHeading").prepend ('<div style = "margin:auto;padding:20px;width:100%;text-align:center;background-color:#00ee54;">This is a <a href = "/wiki/Category:Potential_treatments">Potential treatments</a> page</div>'); // pivot fix("h1.title"...


So any h1 headings should apply class="title" and text not using the "h1" style should include class="firstHeading". We should probably move these colors to MediaWiki:Common.css, perhaps creating a class for each banner style with the relevant background and font colors.

Suggested new formatting: using low vision sky blue to slightly improve contrast, fixing text color rather than changing depending on if the link has been visited or not, and a text shadow to improve visibly.

.title {
background-color: #56b4e9;
color: white;
margin:auto;
width:100%;
text-align: center;
font-size: 1.8em;
}
.title a {
color: white !important;
font-weight: bold;
}


Change code on MediaWiki:Top-notice-Biopsychosocial model to:

<div class="title" style="background: #56b4e9">This is a [[:Category:Medical_hypotheses|Medical hypothesis]] page.</div>


~Njt (talk) 16:55, October 25, 2019 (EDT)Njt (talk) 16:40, October 25, 2019 (EDT)Njt (talk) 16:08, October 25, 2019 (EDT)

Code now above. I think I over-complicated explanation - won't add new features, just better color contrast and text shadow which works on all skins (light and dark). Once confirmed working small updates needed to MediaWiki:Common.js for both Potential treatments and Medical hypothesis banners. Pretty much looks like this (but with a link):

This is a Medical hypothesis page.
User:Pyrrhus ~Njt (talk) 16:55, October 25, 2019 (EDT)
This sounds like a new feature request. You can start a new section for this request at MediaWiki talk:Common.js. This talk page will be deleted once I am done testing the new banner.
Pyrrhus (talk) 16:31, October 25, 2019 (EDT)
I think I understand now. One question: Is "title" a new CSS class or an existing class? If it's a new class, maybe we should choose a more unique name such as "custom-header" or something that won't conflict with other classes? User:Notjusttired
Pyrrhus (talk) 18:25, October 25, 2019 (EDT)

## Bulk Import

Done  Thanks User:Kmdenmark

content hidden
<mediawiki xmlns="http://www.mediawiki.org/xml/export-0.10/" xmlns:xsi="http://www.w3.org/2001/XMLSchema-instance" xsi:schemaLocation="http://www.mediawiki.org/xml/export-0.10/ http://www.mediawiki.org/xml/export-0.10.xsd" version="0.10" xml:lang="en">
<siteinfo>
<sitename>MEpedia</sitename>
<dbname>me_pedia_org_3</dbname>
<base>https://www.me-pedia.org/wiki/Welcome_to_MEpedia</base>
<generator>MediaWiki 1.30.0</generator>
<case>first-letter</case>
<namespaces>
<namespace key="-2" case="first-letter">Media</namespace>
<namespace key="-1" case="first-letter">Special</namespace>
<namespace key="0" case="first-letter" />
<namespace key="1" case="first-letter">Talk</namespace>
<namespace key="2" case="first-letter">User</namespace>
<namespace key="3" case="first-letter">User talk</namespace>
<namespace key="4" case="first-letter">MEpedia</namespace>
<namespace key="5" case="first-letter">MEpedia talk</namespace>
<namespace key="6" case="first-letter">File</namespace>
<namespace key="7" case="first-letter">File talk</namespace>
<namespace key="8" case="first-letter">MediaWiki</namespace>
<namespace key="9" case="first-letter">MediaWiki talk</namespace>
<namespace key="10" case="first-letter">Template</namespace>
<namespace key="11" case="first-letter">Template talk</namespace>
<namespace key="12" case="first-letter">Help</namespace>
<namespace key="13" case="first-letter">Help talk</namespace>
<namespace key="14" case="first-letter">Category</namespace>
<namespace key="15" case="first-letter">Category talk</namespace>
<namespace key="828" case="first-letter">Module</namespace>
<namespace key="829" case="first-letter">Module talk</namespace>
<namespace key="3006" case="first-letter">Portal</namespace>
<namespace key="3007" case="first-letter">Portal talk</namespace>
</namespaces>
</siteinfo>
<page>
<title>MediaWiki:Pagetriage-tags-cleanup-desc</title>
<ns>8</ns>
<revision>
<model>wikitext</model>
<format>text/x-wiki</format>
</revision>
</page>
<page>
<title>MediaWiki:Pagetriage-tags-cleanup-desc/de</title>
<ns>8</ns>
<revision>
<model>wikitext</model>
<format>text/x-wiki</format>
<text xml:space="preserve">Dieser Artikel muss möglicherweise Überarbeitet werden, um die [[MEpedia:Guidelines|Richtlinien von MEpedia]] zu erfüllen.</text>
</revision>
</page>
</mediawiki>

## Translations to do

Pyrrhus may change footer text or links eg MediaWiki:Wikimedia-developers and it's URL

content hidden

Cleanup Reason given is User:Pyrrhus can you also do these 3 imports. Njt (talk) 06:54, September 28, 2019 (EDT)

Done 181 pages imported. Please check to make sure that all pages were correctly imported.
Pyrrhus (talk) 19:00, September 30, 2019 (EDT)
Great, thanks. There's just the German one that I must have got the wrong message in. I've tagged you in the talk page with the right translation. ~Njt (talk)|
Cleanup-reason-is all done so code deleted ~Njt (talk) 20:31, October 6, 2019 (EDT)

### No-reason custom message (done)

Basically an export of Lqt_noreason messages, but with the message name changed. Ready to import User:Pyrrhus. ~Njt (talk) 23:45, October 6, 2019 (EDT)

All done.
content hidden

<mediawiki xmlns="http://www.mediawiki.org/xml/export-0.10/" xmlns:xsi="http://www.w3.org/2001/XMLSchema-instance" xsi:schemaLocation="http://www.mediawiki.org/xml/export-0.10/ http://www.mediawiki.org/xml/export-0.10.xsd" version="0.10" xml:lang="en">
<siteinfo>
<sitename>translatewiki.net</sitename>
<dbname>translatewiki_net</dbname>
<base>https://translatewiki.net/</base>
<generator>MediaWiki 1.34.0-alpha</generator>
<case>first-letter</case>
<namespaces>
<namespace key="0" case="first-letter" />
<namespace key="14" case="first-letter">Category</namespace>
<namespace key="15" case="first-letter">Category talk</namespace>
<namespace key="208" case="first-letter">Concept</namespace>
<namespace key="209" case="first-letter">Concept talk</namespace>
<namespace key="6" case="first-letter">File</namespace>
<namespace key="7" case="first-letter">File talk</namespace>
<namespace key="106" case="first-letter">Form</namespace>
<namespace key="107" case="first-letter">Form talk</namespace>
<namespace key="12" case="first-letter">Help</namespace>
<namespace key="13" case="first-letter">Help talk</namespace>
<namespace key="-2" case="first-letter">Media</namespace>
<namespace key="100" case="first-letter">Portal</namespace>
<namespace key="101" case="first-letter">Portal talk</namespace>
<namespace key="4" case="first-letter">Project</namespace>
<namespace key="5" case="first-letter">Project talk</namespace>
<namespace key="202" case="first-letter">Property</namespace>
<namespace key="203" case="first-letter">Property talk</namespace>
<namespace key="214" case="first-letter">Rule</namespace>
<namespace key="215" case="first-letter">Rule talk</namespace>
<namespace key="212" case="first-letter">smw/schema</namespace>
<namespace key="213" case="first-letter">smw/schema talk</namespace>
<namespace key="-1" case="first-letter">Special</namespace>
<namespace key="92" case="first-letter">Summary</namespace>
<namespace key="93" case="first-letter">Summary talk</namespace>
<namespace key="1" case="first-letter">Talk</namespace>
<namespace key="10" case="first-letter">Template</namespace>
<namespace key="11" case="first-letter">Template talk</namespace>
<namespace key="1102" case="first-letter">Translating</namespace>
<namespace key="1103" case="first-letter">Translating talk</namespace>
<namespace key="2" case="first-letter">User</namespace>
<namespace key="3" case="first-letter">User talk</namespace>
<namespace key="1276" case="case-sensitive">Ajapaik</namespace>
<namespace key="1277" case="case-sensitive">Ajapaik talk</namespace>
<namespace key="1256" case="first-letter">Blockly</namespace>
<namespace key="1257" case="first-letter">Blockly talk</namespace>
<namespace key="1214" case="first-letter">Commonist</namespace>
<namespace key="1215" case="first-letter">Commonist talk</namespace>
<namespace key="1272" case="case-sensitive">Dissemin</namespace>
<namespace key="1273" case="case-sensitive">Dissemin talk</namespace>
<namespace key="1264" case="case-sensitive">EntryScape</namespace>
<namespace key="1265" case="case-sensitive">EntryScape talk</namespace>
<namespace key="1242" case="first-letter">EOL</namespace>
<namespace key="1243" case="first-letter">EOL talk</namespace>
<namespace key="1236" case="first-letter">Europeana</namespace>
<namespace key="1237" case="first-letter">Europeana talk</namespace>
<namespace key="1202" case="first-letter">FreeCol</namespace>
<namespace key="1203" case="first-letter">FreeCol talk</namespace>
<namespace key="1218" case="first-letter">FUDforum</namespace>
<namespace key="1219" case="first-letter">FUDforum talk</namespace>
<namespace key="1254" case="first-letter">FUEL</namespace>
<namespace key="1255" case="first-letter">FUEL talk</namespace>
<namespace key="1266" case="case-sensitive">Hivejs</namespace>
<namespace key="1267" case="case-sensitive">Hivejs talk</namespace>
<namespace key="1248" case="first-letter">Huggle</namespace>
<namespace key="1249" case="first-letter">Huggle talk</namespace>
<namespace key="1228" case="first-letter">iHRIS</namespace>
<namespace key="1229" case="first-letter">iHRIS talk</namespace>
<namespace key="1262" case="first-letter">iNaturalist</namespace>
<namespace key="1263" case="first-letter">iNaturalist talk</namespace>
<namespace key="1240" case="first-letter">Intuition</namespace>
<namespace key="1241" case="first-letter">Intuition talk</namespace>
<namespace key="1244" case="first-letter">Kiwix</namespace>
<namespace key="1245" case="first-letter">Kiwix talk</namespace>
<namespace key="1268" case="case-sensitive">lib.reviews</namespace>
<namespace key="1269" case="case-sensitive">lib.reviews talk</namespace>
<namespace key="1278" case="case-sensitive">LibreMesh</namespace>
<namespace key="1279" case="case-sensitive">LibreMesh talk</namespace>
<namespace key="1210" case="first-letter">Mantis</namespace>
<namespace key="1211" case="first-letter">Mantis talk</namespace>
<namespace key="1258" case="first-letter">MathJax</namespace>
<namespace key="1259" case="first-letter">MathJax talk</namespace>
<namespace key="1280" case="case-sensitive">MAZI</namespace>
<namespace key="1281" case="case-sensitive">MAZI talk</namespace>
<namespace key="8" case="first-letter">MediaWiki</namespace>
<namespace key="9" case="first-letter">MediaWiki talk</namespace>
<namespace key="1230" case="first-letter">Mifos</namespace>
<namespace key="1231" case="first-letter">Mifos talk</namespace>
<namespace key="1246" case="first-letter">Mozilla</namespace>
<namespace key="1247" case="first-letter">Mozilla talk</namespace>
<namespace key="1212" case="first-letter">Mwlib</namespace>
<namespace key="1213" case="first-letter">Mwlib talk</namespace>
<namespace key="1260" case="first-letter">NFCRingControl</namespace>
<namespace key="1261" case="first-letter">NFCRingControl talk</namespace>
<namespace key="1204" case="first-letter">Nocc</namespace>
<namespace key="1205" case="first-letter">Nocc talk</namespace>
<namespace key="1220" case="first-letter">Okawix</namespace>
<namespace key="1221" case="first-letter">Okawix talk</namespace>
<namespace key="1234" case="first-letter">OpenImages</namespace>
<namespace key="1235" case="first-letter">OpenImages talk</namespace>
<namespace key="1216" case="first-letter">OpenLayers</namespace>
<namespace key="1217" case="first-letter">OpenLayers talk</namespace>
<namespace key="1270" case="case-sensitive">Oppia</namespace>
<namespace key="1271" case="case-sensitive">Oppia talk</namespace>
<namespace key="1222" case="first-letter">Osm</namespace>
<namespace key="1223" case="first-letter">Osm talk</namespace>
<namespace key="1274" case="case-sensitive">Phabricator</namespace>
<namespace key="1275" case="case-sensitive">Phabricator talk</namespace>
<namespace key="1238" case="first-letter">Pywikibot</namespace>
<namespace key="1239" case="first-letter">Pywikibot talk</namespace>
<namespace key="1208" case="first-letter">StatusNet</namespace>
<namespace key="1209" case="first-letter">StatusNet talk</namespace>
<namespace key="1198" case="first-letter">Translations</namespace>
<namespace key="1199" case="first-letter">Translations talk</namespace>
<namespace key="1252" case="first-letter">Vicuna</namespace>
<namespace key="1253" case="first-letter">Vicuna talk</namespace>
<namespace key="1200" case="first-letter">Voctrain</namespace>
<namespace key="1201" case="first-letter">Voctrain talk</namespace>
<namespace key="1232" case="first-letter">Wikia</namespace>
<namespace key="1233" case="first-letter">Wikia talk</namespace>
<namespace key="1282" case="case-sensitive">Wikidocumentaries</namespace>
<namespace key="1283" case="case-sensitive">Wikidocumentaries talk</namespace>
<namespace key="1206" case="first-letter">Wikimedia</namespace>
<namespace key="1207" case="first-letter">Wikimedia talk</namespace>
</namespaces>
</siteinfo>
<page>
<title>MediaWiki:No-reason/ar</title>
<ns>8</ns>
<id>114330</id>
<revision>
<id>161369</id>
<timestamp>2007-11-23T07:44:38Z</timestamp>
<contributor>
<id>315</id>
</contributor>
<model>wikitext</model>
<format>text/x-wiki</format>
<text xml:space="preserve" bytes="21">لا سبب معطى.</text>
<sha1>trbxdtbjsbqc6n7do97xtdlikuiljet</sha1>
</revision>
</page>
<page>
<title>MediaWiki:No-reason/da</title>
<ns>8</ns>
<id>2057108</id>
<revision>
<id>2951594</id>
<timestamp>2011-04-25T05:34:11Z</timestamp>
<contributor>
<id>3782</id>
</contributor>
<model>wikitext</model>
<format>text/x-wiki</format>
<text xml:space="preserve" bytes="26">Ingen begrundelse angivet.</text>
<sha1>ic5gwik8pqulwwq8x9ubgdkkqt7e68k</sha1>
</revision>
</page>
<page>
<title>MediaWiki:No-reason/fi</title>
<ns>8</ns>
<id>909955</id>
<revision>
<id>1289062</id>
<timestamp>2009-07-02T10:52:16Z</timestamp>
<contributor>
<id>283</id>
</contributor>
<comment>suomeksi</comment>
<model>wikitext</model>
<format>text/x-wiki</format>
<text xml:space="preserve" bytes="19">Ei annettua syytä.</text>
<sha1>0rcsgy11ym0psz051cyj70nan4gwyl7</sha1>
</revision>
</page>
<page>
<title>MediaWiki:No-reason/it</title>
<ns>8</ns>
<id>1033853</id>
<revision>
<id>1460274</id>
<timestamp>2009-08-29T17:10:40Z</timestamp>
<contributor>
<id>2110</id>
</contributor>
<comment>Translate</comment>
<model>wikitext</model>
<format>text/x-wiki</format>
<text xml:space="preserve" bytes="29">Nessuna motivazione indicata.</text>
<sha1>b0nip64qeghwffvyr0463rpzvupwdns</sha1>
</revision>
</page>
<page>
<title>MediaWiki:No-reason/ja</title>
<ns>8</ns>
<id>191005</id>
<revision>
<id>261562</id>
<timestamp>2008-02-17T16:20:46Z</timestamp>
<contributor>
<id>791</id>
</contributor>
<comment>translate</comment>
<model>wikitext</model>
<format>text/x-wiki</format>
<text xml:space="preserve" bytes="39">理由は付記されていません。</text>
<sha1>1d2qt9uhieh8c9hoptqqfth6x1waa8f</sha1>
</revision>
</page>
<page>
<title>MediaWiki:No-reason/pl</title>
<ns>8</ns>
<id>215941</id>
<revision>
<id>1491831</id>
<parentid>294155</parentid>
<timestamp>2009-09-15T16:34:01Z</timestamp>
<contributor>
<id>921</id>
</contributor>
<model>wikitext</model>
<format>text/x-wiki</format>
<text xml:space="preserve" bytes="18">Nie podano powodu.</text>
<sha1>m5y060qmskof0mqy0j2e61ewfdrtr5i</sha1>
</revision>
</page>
<page>
<title>MediaWiki:No-reason/pt</title>
<ns>8</ns>
<id>178383</id>
<revision>
<id>1727893</id>
<parentid>243351</parentid>
<timestamp>2009-12-05T02:00:11Z</timestamp>
<contributor>
<id>2715</id>
</contributor>
<model>wikitext</model>
<format>text/x-wiki</format>
<text xml:space="preserve" bytes="36">Não foi especificado nenhum motivo.</text>
<sha1>avtjeyv5wb49krj6tbgx32c1bhdhnhn</sha1>
</revision>
</page>
<page>
<title>MediaWiki:No-reason/ru</title>
<ns>8</ns>
<id>132336</id>
<revision>
<id>1446038</id>
<parentid>183803</parentid>
<timestamp>2009-08-22T07:30:26Z</timestamp>
<contributor>
<id>2463</id>
</contributor>
<comment>correction</comment>
<model>wikitext</model>
<format>text/x-wiki</format>
<text xml:space="preserve" bytes="35">Не указана причина.</text>
<sha1>j6tvgosjjberi6m3gqq61eqa0kncte0</sha1>
</revision>
</page>
<page>
<title>MediaWiki:No-reason/sv</title>
<ns>8</ns>
<id>191517</id>
<revision>
<id>262234</id>
<timestamp>2008-02-18T08:13:15Z</timestamp>
<contributor>
<id>802</id>
</contributor>
<model>wikitext</model>
<format>text/x-wiki</format>
<text xml:space="preserve" bytes="22">Ingen anledning given.</text>
<sha1>cycjvls08gyso44n0t7c0p3os4p3oo6</sha1>
</revision>
</page>
<page>
<title>MediaWiki:No-reason/vi</title>
<ns>8</ns>
<id>254886</id>
<revision>
<id>350621</id>
<timestamp>2008-04-11T03:42:28Z</timestamp>
<contributor>
<id>709</id>
</contributor>
<model>wikitext</model>
<format>text/x-wiki</format>
<text xml:space="preserve" bytes="23">Không đưa ra lý do.</text>
<sha1>242zviqquhnat6dle2aurg8pbgs6kin</sha1>
</revision>
</page>
<page>
<title>MediaWiki:No-reason/zh-hans</title>
<ns>8</ns>
<id>512160</id>
<revision>
<id>1445831</id>
<parentid>698700</parentid>
<timestamp>2009-08-22T07:06:14Z</timestamp>
<contributor>
<id>646</id>
</contributor>
<comment>Updating translation from external source</comment>
<model>wikitext</model>
<format>text/x-wiki</format>
<text xml:space="preserve" bytes="18">未给出原因。</text>
<sha1>mo3jtv9i5zrlb79gd6tbqc0zu2nh5sa</sha1>
</revision>
</page>
<page>
<title>MediaWiki:No-reason/zh-hant</title>
<ns>8</ns>
<id>125571</id>
<revision>
<id>5561381</id>
<parentid>175199</parentid>
<timestamp>2014-05-26T17:35:19Z</timestamp>
<contributor>
<id>4987</id>
</contributor>
<model>wikitext</model>
<format>text/x-wiki</format>
<text xml:space="preserve" bytes="18">未說明原因。</text>
<sha1>fgjh29koetf7sxb79nfbcjfya4p84a0</sha1>
</revision>
</page>
</mediawiki>



custom messages

## MediaWiki:Moodbar-action-reason-required

content hidden

User:Kmdenmark can you please create these? ~Njt (talk) 20:27, October 11, 2019 (EDT)

Done Kmdenmark (talk) 14:52, October 15, 2019 (EDT)
Proporciona una razón. Esta página necesita una reorganización para cumplir con las recomendaciones de diseño. Le contenu de cette page a besoin d’être réorganisé pour respecter les recommandations. Deze pagina heeft extra referenties of bronnen nodig voor controleerbaarheid.
Great,  Thanks ~Njt (talk) 16:57, October 15, 2019 (EDT)

Done

content hidden

If anyone of you could help with the translations below I would really appreciate it. It's to help Non-English speakers upload files. notjusttired (talk) 06:45, August 16, 2019 (EDT) User:Hannosch User:sigridjones User:Sisyphus User:Guido den Broeder User:DaviSpain

If you want to add languages you speak to your user page you can find user boxes on Template:Userbox Thank you notjusttired (talk) 06:45, August 16, 2019 (EDT)

• CC-by-sa-3.0|I created this and anyone can alter or copy it, but credit me as the author
• CC-by-nd-4.0|I created this and anyone can copy it but don't alter it, and credit me as the author
• CC-zero|I created this and I don’t care what anyone does to it, no one has to credit me as the author
• PD|Public domain
• PD-USGov|Public domain US Government
• GFDL|GFDL: GNU Free Documentation License
• LGPL|LGPL: GNU Lesser General Public License
• FAL|Free Art License (artlibre.org) (artlibre.org)
• CC-zero|Creative Commons Zero - Public domain
• CC Share-Alike:
• CC-by-sa-4.0|Creative Commons ShareAlike 4.0
• CC-by-sa-3.0|Creative Commons ShareAlike 3.0
• CC-by-sa-2.5|Creative Commons ShareAlike 2.5
• CC-by-sa-2.0|Creative Commons ShareAlike 2.0
• CC other:
• CC-by-nc-4.0|CC NonCommercial 4.0
• CC-by-nc-3.0|CC NonCommercial 3.0
• CC-by-nc-2.5|CC NonCommercial 2.5
• CC-by-nc-2.0|CC NonCommercial 2.0
• CC-by-nc-nd-4.0|CC NonCommercial No-Derivs 4.0
• CC-by-nd-4.0|CC No-Derivs 4.0
• ⧼Other⧽:

## English

• I don't know exactly
• I created this and anyone can copy it but don't alter it, and credit me as the author
• I created this and anyone can alter or copy it, but credit me as the author
• I created this and I don’t care what anyone does to it, no one has to credit me as the author
• Public domain
• Public domain US Government
• Other:
• Other: Please leave detailed explanation

## Français

• GFDL: Licence de documentation libre GNU
• LGPL : licence publique générale limitée GNU
• Attribution - Pas d'Utilisation Commerciale - Pas de Modification 4.0 International (CC BY-NC-ND 4.0)
• I don't know exactly
• I created this and anyone can copy it but don't alter it, and credit me as the author
• I created this and anyone can alter or copy it, but credit me as the author
• I created this and I don’t care what anyone does to it, no one has to credit me as the author
• Public domain
• Public domain US Government
• Other:
• Other: Please leave detailed explanation

## Deutsch

Done

• Nicht kommerziell - Keine Bearbeitungen 4.0 International (CC BY-NC-ND 4.0)
• Nicht kommerziell 4.0 International (CC BY-NC 4.0)
• Keine Bearbeitungen 4.0 International (CC BY-ND 4.0)
• GFDL - GNU-Lizenz für freie Dokumentation

content hidden
• Ich weiß es nicht sicher
• Ich habe dies erstellt und es darf von jedem genutzt werden, aber bitte verändere es nicht und nenne mich als Autor
• Ich habe dies erstellt und jeder darf es verändern und kopieren, aber bitte nenne mich als Autor
• Ich habe dies erstellt und es ist mir egal, wie es genutzt wird, niemand braucht mich als Autor zu nennen
• Freie Lizenzen:
• Öffentliche Domain
• Öffentliche Domain US-Regierung
• Lizenz für freie Kunst
• Weitere:
• Fairer Gebrauch: Bitte erläutere die Ausnahmen vom Copyright (z.B. Stipendium/Forschung)
• Andere: Bitte detailliert erläutern

## Español

• I don't know exactly
• I created this and anyone can copy it but don't alter it, and credit me as the author
• I created this and anyone can alter or copy it, but credit me as the author
• I created this and I don’t care what anyone does to it, no one has to credit me as the author
• Public domain
• Public domain US Government
• Other:
• Other: Please leave detailed explanation

## Nederland

• I don't know exactly
• I created this and anyone can copy it but don't alter it, and credit me as the author
• I created this and anyone can alter or copy it, but credit me as the author
• I created this and I don’t care what anyone does to it, no one has to credit me as the author
• Public domain
• Public domain US Government
• Other:
• Other: Please leave detailed explanation

## Other

• I don't know exactly
• I created this and anyone can copy it but don't alter it, and credit me as the author
• I created this and anyone can alter or copy it, but credit me as the author
• I created this and I don’t care what anyone does to it, no one has to credit me as the author
• Public domain
• Public domain US Government
• Other:
• Other: Please leave detailed explanation

I've tried to translate it into Dutch an French but it isn't that easy. These Copyright terms are quite specific and ifrequently used in ordinary language. So perhaps you could let other Dutch/French speakers check if it sounds ok. - Sisyphus

Thanks for your help User:Sisyphus, I will do that with the copyright specific ones. notjusttired (talk) 17:50, August 17, 2019 (EDT)
• English
• Dutch
• French

• Auteursrecht ongekend

• I don't know exactly
• Ik weet het niet precies
• Je ne sais pas exactement

• I created this and anyone can copy it but don't alter it, and credit me as the author
• Ik heb dit gemaakt en iedereen mag het kopiëren, maar wijzig het niet en vermeldt me als auteur
• J'ai créé ceci et tout le monde peut le copier mais ne le modifie pas, et créditez-moi comme auteur

• I created this and anyone can alter or copy it, but credit me as the author
• Ik heb dit gemaakt en iedereen mag het kopiëren en wijzigen, maar vermeldt me als auteur
• J'ai créé ceci et tout le monde peut le copier ou le modifier mais créditez-moi comme auteur

• I created this and I don’t care what anyone does to it, no one has to credit me as the author
• Ik heb dit gemaakt en iedereen mag het gebruiken naar goeddunken; je hoeft me niet als auteur te vermelden
• J'ai créé ceci et tout le monde peut l’utiliser comme il veut ; one ne doit pas me créditer comme auteur.

• Free licences
• Vrije licentie
• Licence libre

• Public domain
• Publiek domein
• Domaine public

• Public domain US Government
• Publiek domein, overheid van de Verenigde Staten van Amerika
• Domaine public, gouvernement des États-Unis

• Vrijekunstlicentie
• Licence Art Libre

• Faire Use: verduidelijk alstublieft de uitzonderingen op auteursrecht (bijv. voor studiebeurzen/ onderzoek)
• Faire Use: explique les exceptions au droit d’auteur (p. ex. bourse/recherche scientifique)

• Geef alstublieft een gedetailleerde verklaring
• Laissez des explications détaillées

• Template: Used with permission
• Sjabloon: gebruikt met toestemming
• Modèle: utilisé avec permission

• Sjabloon: Fair Use licentie
• Modèle: Licence Faire Use

• Sjabloon: ongekend auteursrecht

• Sjabloon: Inbreuk tegen het auteursrecht
• Modèle: Atteinte au droit d'auteur

|}</div>

## Archived messages

content hidden

### Tweet

Hey Njt! I noticed a weird error message regarding the Tweet/doc page at category:Pages_with_incorrect_formatting_templates_use. I really don’t know what to make of it, maybe it makes more sense to you... Cheers!
Pyrrhus (talk) 20:07, July 6, 2019 (EDT)

Do you mean the date script error? I think the Math extension might be needed for that template (which isn't in use yet). It fails because the Extract template it uses doesn't work. notjusttired (talk) 15:13, July 7, 2019 (EDT)
Now fixed User:Pyrrhus notjusttired (talk) 06:29, August 6, 2019 (EDT)

### Re: Leave me a message -- sigrid.jones (talk) 04:20, August 6, 2019 (EDT)

Thank you! I just added some user boxes. Happy to be here. Best regards, Sigrid --sigrid.jones (talk) 04:05, August 6, 2019 (EDT)

### Deleting pages problem

Hi notjusttired! I started deleting some of the pages you cited for deletion, however, without them the references no longer populate, so I restored several. Please advise. Thanks, Kmdenmark (talk) 16:44, June 26, 2019 (EDT)

Hi Kmdenmark! I see that the "Articles for deletion" category is broken, and it is showing a number of template pages that were never marked for deletion. I will look into the problem later on today or tomorrow and then I will get back to you. In the meantime, please restore the following templates that still need to be restored: Template:Chem2, Template:Chem2/doc, Template:Citation needed/doc, Template:Composition bar, Template:Composition bar/doc, Template:Coord/doc. Thanks!
Pyrrhus (talk) 17:16, June 26, 2019 (EDT)
Pyrrhus Thanks! Take your time with it. I'll restore the ones deleted and will ignore the list until further notice. Kmdenmark (talk) 17:40, June 26, 2019 (EDT)
Yikes! User:Kmdenmark All the ones I marked for deletion today start with "Template:Template:" so those should be fine to delete, and all should have a similarly named page with "Template:" just mentioned once. I can't imagine what happened here. notjusttired (talk) 18:05, June 26, 2019 (EDT)
Please hold off on deleting anything. There maybe some weird unanticipated link between the templates we want deleted and those we don’t want deleted...
Pyrrhus (talk) 18:26, June 26, 2019 (EDT)
Pyrrhus and notjusttired, I'll hold off from deleting anything for now. I'm assuming that keeping the pages for now will not interfere with other operations. Kmdenmark (talk) 11:51, June 27, 2019 (EDT)
User:Pyrrhus User:Kmdenmark I believe it's fixed now. I accidentally marked 2 templates that are needed for deletion, and they must be transclusions, so they added the deletion category to every template that used them. Can you please add protection to these 2 pages to prevent this happening again - the pages are Template:Template_other and Template:Template_error_report. The pages I had intended for deletion all had "Template:" in the name not just "Template", and all should be blank except for the deletion category. Perhaps you can both check if Category:Articles for deletion looks right now. I'm really sorry for the problems caused by my mistake. notjusttired (talk) 14:16, June 27, 2019 (EDT)
looks good to me, thanks njt!
Pyrrhus (talk) 14:48, June 27, 2019 (EDT)

### Pivot

Hi Njt! Hope you’re enjoying your weekend. In case you missed it, the Pivot skin comes with some configuration variables. For more info, see https://pivot.wikiproject.net/wiki/Pivot_features
Here is some example code you may be interested in:

$wgPivotFeatures = [ 'navbarIcon' => true, 'addThisPUBID' => 'ra-5cdfe8dacb9028fa' ];$wgAddThisSidebar = true;


(Code obviously comes after wfLoadSkin( 'pivot' );.) Hope this helps.
Pyrrhus (talk) 17:40, May 25, 2019 (EDT)

I've seen that, thanks. The publisher ID I requested and should sort the sidebar issue. Oddly the side bar setting does not work as you'd expect given the name! The logo setting might be withwhile but only applies to the smallest mobiles and puts the logo in the centre of the top bar! I've swapped the font and style of the title bar for the moment, and got it displayed #MEpedia. See code on MediaWiki_talk:Pivot.css for .p-logo-text. When the weekend is over In going to put in a request to add the MEAction fonts for ALL skins, which will mean we can use the logo text style anywhere. notjusttired (talk) 17:51, May 25, 2019 (EDT)

Hi! Just checking if you need me to make any other changes. Hope all is well Kmdenmark (talk) 17:31, 16 May 2019 (EDT)

Thank you for the offer of help. I'm making a lot of changes to the 2 new skins so that would be great. Can you do the new code for Timeless, like you did for the Pivot one? It's on here MediaWiki_talk:Timeless.css and needs to overwrite MediaWiki:Timeless.css totally, which will be easier than deleting the sections causing layout issues. Thanks again notjusttired (talk) 15:41, 17 May 2019 (EDT)

### Archived

"Hi Njt! I noticed the following suggestion of yours in the Dev queue of MEpedia:Suggested_tasks:
"Create custom Special page for tracking pages using NeedsImage template requested by User:Notjusttired"
Am I wrong or missing something? Thanks.
Pyrrhus (talk) 19:22, 28 March 2019 (EDT)

Have done that now. I originally hoped to add or as a Tracking category in special pages so it's easy to find, but there's no simple way to do this. Would rather focus on other dev tasks.
Have you got any thoughts on different skins? I added some to the Dev queue including a dark one. notjusttired (talk) 17:18, 30 March 2019 (EDT)
BTW, I recently created a page to collate all those weird special pages together: MEpedia:Pages in need
The idea is that there would be a link in the lefthand sidebar to this "Pages in need" page so that contributors would have quick access to all these weird special pages. I'm pretty clueless on skins, so no opinion here, but I'll try to take a look. Thanks for all your help, Njt!
Pyrrhus (talk) 18:47, 30 March 2019 (EDT)
okay, I’ve finally taken a look at skins. It looks like you are recommending TimelessDarkCSS as a light-sensitive option and Pivot as the Mobile option. Is this correct?
Also, i note that your user page mentions “collapsible lists”. Do you know of any way to do that? That would be ideal for the Contents page...
Pyrrhus (talk) 18:59, 10 April 2019 (EDT)
Hi Pyrrhus. Yes to the Timeless-DarkCSS for those with photophobia or preferring a dark background.
The Pivot skin is brilliant for mobile devices and tablets but actually looks excellent on a Desktop (in my view) - Timeless without the dark CSS is a serif font I seem to remember and also looks good on mobiles, tablets and desktops. The norm is to default to Vector for wikis but Vector is really hard work on small screens because you can't hide the side menu - either you zoom and scroll a lot or need the most amazing vision.
Assuming these get installed and work as well as expected it should be nice to have a button to flip to the dark skin for those not logged in . I haven't seen the code to do this yet though. notjusttired (talk) 16:44, 11 April 2019 (EDT)
okay, here’s what it looks like we should do:
1. Install Timeless-DarkCSS and Pivot skins
2. Put two links in the lefthand/top sidebar: “Light-sensitive interface” and “Mobile-friendly interface”. These links will bring up instructions for how to switch skins in the user’s Preferences. When we find the code for a not-logged-in-user button, we’ll replace the links with buttons.
3. If the Pivot interface turns out to be as good as you say, we should talk about making Pivot the default interface for all devices.
Does that look right?
Pyrrhus (talk) 17:25, 11 April 2019 (EDT)
Yes, that's right, although I think calling it "dark view" or "dark version" would be better. Dark timeless is simply a skin called Timeless with extra CSS, Timeless has almost the same features as Pivot so it might be a case of seeing whether Timeless in white is more popular than Pivot - I prefer Pivot myself. There's 2 different ways to automatically switch skins for mobile users Method 1 and Mobile Frontend method which would allow desktop users to stay on Vector automatically. If you want to checkout hope they look on different screen sizes then Screenfly is pretty good notjusttired (talk) 18:50, 11 April 2019 (EDT)

"

## Renaming?

I renamed this page to use the US spelling, as per the Manual of Style. User:kmdenmark But should the category be renamed to British Organizations? This would be easier to browse from Category:Organizations because the country make would be first and the name is shorter. The same issue is there for Universities. This would also fit with the Standard MEpedia country categories eg Category:British research initiatives. I've created a temporary MEpedia Page Outlines for both Universities and Organizations but would welcome input / Ch changes from others. notjusttired (talk) 18:14, 20 February 2019 (EST)

The changes are fine with me. I have no attachment to either way. I think "Organizations based in the United Kingdom" is a bit long and awkward but it's the category title that Wikipedia uses. (Wikipedia page for "Organizations based in the United Kingdom") Kmdenmark (talk) 19:03, 21 February 2019 (EST)

|}</div>

## Categories for UK politicians

Hi. Can you avoid removing politicians from the categories for political parties? This is crucial information for advocacy and not held elsewhere. Labour/Co-op members are considered members of both parties so need to be in more than one category. Keeping them as categories allows someone to look for UK adbocates, then use the subcategories to find just politicians for political parties or fod which committee they are on - one committee is investigating the PACE trial Parties cover both MPs and the unelected House of Lords.

Thank you for explaining the need for categories for politicians. I see your point and will not delete them anymore. Kmdenmark (talk) 14:29, 11 February 2019 (EST)
Thanks notjusttired (talk) 19:01, 11 February 2019 (EST)

Also please don't mark redirects for deletion - they are there to help from the correctly spelled page - searching the incorrect name means MEpedia then find the correct page name too. notjusttired (talk) 13:06, 7 February 2019 (EST)

Re: misspellings - I don't think misspellings should be honored with redirects. It is impossible to conceive of every misspelling that someone could use. I think the misspellings clutter the drop down menu in our search engine and make articles harder to find rather than easier. I support using redirects for alternative spellings, but not misspellings. If you can give me an example of one of the redirects you want to stay, it would help me understand your reasoning. I, also, eliminated some redirects where pages were not medically the same and to keep them as such would be inaccurate. A better way to link similar but different pages would be with links in the 'See also' section. (I don't know if you were the author of those redirects, but I wanted to explain why I eliminated those redirects, also.) My best, Kmdenmark (talk) 14:29, 11 February 2019 (EST)
It depends on the reason for the mispelling and how common it is. Eg if you delete the redirect for Intestinal permiability and type of into a search the correct page name won't come up - there's no results. Delete redirects for different spacing in page names and that search phrase may not work any more (eg The M.E. Society vs The ME Society). There's also a few unexpected UK vs US spellings (diarrhoea), and a few researchers with names that are commonly mispelled or have very similar spellings, which sometimes means their research is under several different names (AT Anbu vs Theo Anbu). When it comes to linking redirects have a link icon next to the page name, so it's easy to pick the right one - although perhaps there is a hidden property that can be used.
I'm fine with trying it your way. Let's watch how the redirects work and see if we get other feedback from users.
A couple specific points: Sometimes the search engine is extra slow or temporary not working; that may explain why the correct spelling for Intestinal permeability didn't come up when you originally searched. I tested it and it came up every time I searched this morning.
Re: British spelling. I wholeheartedly agree that redirects for British spellings should have redirects. The main title is to be in American spelling as per MEpedia manual of style. My best, Kmdenmark (talk) 12:01, 12 February 2019 (EST)
Thanks User:Kmdenmark - I've noticed performance problems but that has been loading pages rather than on searches. Maybe there's something else going on.

With making redirects for deletion, they need any pages using them to be updated first. The Contents page (which I can't edit) has a non-standard List of Quotes link, so deleting to use the correct capitalization breaks the link on the Contents page.
(hide)

## Messages I've seen

RE: Csn the Mike Beadsworth page be the main one, with Michael Beadsworth the redirect? Professionally he uses the name Mike far more.
Njt


notjusttired (talk) 13:58, 23 January 2019 (EST)

Sure, sounds good. Kmdenmark (talk) 17:19, 23 January 2019 (EST)

Just FYI: On the Pathogen page, you have left the following typo: "_Chia_201dorferi_paper.png"

I can't fix the typo since I'm not sure what it was meant to say...

Best, Pyrrhus

Pyrrhus (talk) 20:36, 10 February 2019 (EST)

Thank you Pyrrhus - I'm not sure what image it was supposed to be so I added an alternative and fixed the problem. notjusttired (talk) 09:07, 11 February 2019 (EST)

(hide)

|}</div>

## Priorities

• Check copyrights on ICC and other files
• Better symptom photos e.g. malaise, levels of fatigue and disability, symptoms
• Infographics template - XMP CC info, large size, site name only in corner (font as wiki?)
• Infographic & poster creation

## Welcome to MEpedia!

• To create new page, use one an outline: [MEpedia_article_outlines]

To see your contributions history, click Contributions in the top-right corner. To see recent contributions by others, click Recent Changes on the left. Not ready to edit pages, but want to suggest a change? On the page, just click Discussion, and write your suggestion there for others to see.|realName=Anonymous|name=Notjusttired}}

## Random code

Chronic Fatigue Syndrome: Common Symptoms
Symptom %
Fatigue: persistent or relapsing

100
Symptoms last over 6 months

100
Significant reduction in activities

100
Post-exertional malaise

96
Memory & concentration probs

98
Unrefreshing sleep

99

100
Muscle pain (myalgia)

96
Sore throat

81
Joint pain (arthalgia)

86
Lymph node pain

81
Source: Jason et al.

Common Symptoms in Chronic Fatigue Syndrome

Symptom Mild to Severe
Symptom %
Moderate to Severe
Symptom %
Fatigue - persist or relapsing*
100
95
Significant reduction in activities*
100
100
Symptoms last over 6 months*
100
100
Post-exertional malaise
96
86
Memory & concentration probs
98
80
Unrefreshing sleep
99
92
90
50
Muscle pain (myalgia)
96
73
Sore throat
81
31

Source: Jason et al.

### Messages

Notjustired: Severe and very severe ME Chronological order goes from earliest to latest. Citations are not placed under the study and instead, they are cited. If details like pages are necessary, they can be entered into the citation. --MEcfsFMS (talk) 09:51, 20 October 2018 (EDT)

Hi. Is that somewhere in the editorial standards? I don't remember reading it. I think it's important to add doi to citations of they aren't already in there. I will look at adding author links to the citations too. I created a talk page for the Severe ME image to discuss ideas. notjusttired (talk) 10:15, 20 October 2018 (EDT)

I put doi in and the PMID? But PMC causes an error and I don't think they have figured out why yet. Authors links don't get created and I thought they were in the "Reference" area.--MEcfsFMS (talk) 10:39, 20 October 2018 (EDT)
I see, if the citation automatically creates the citation, authors internal links are created. If they have to be manually input then it does not seem to create them.
That makes sense. I thought people had been spending ages manually adding them or copying and pasting the code for the most common ones. I normally automatically generate a citation, if it doesn't work I use another link or the doi, then replace the finished link with a full text link if necessary. Links from investinme and researchgate normally don't generate automatically so I use a PubMed link and overwrite the link only after the citation is generated.

Could you update the Manual of style with anything else that isn't in there? I'll go back sort the citations I changed. notjusttired (talk) 10:53, 20 October 2018 (EDT)

## MOS - Dates

Hi Notjusttired:

Somewhere at some point early on, I remember the date format was to be US, Jun 10, 2016, and not 10 Jun 2016. I can't remember where or when I read this but a few of us started changing dates in UK format and going forward we used US format. I think Jen had posted about it but I'm not sure. Also, we were to change any UK spellings to the US spelling unless it was a quote.--MEcfsFMS (talk) 14:26, 31 October 2018 (EDT)

ty for letting me know, can you fix what I wrote on MOS - does the same apply to date in citations? Sometimes they cause an error so I presume I put them in as Jun, 28 2018 now?

Yes, that is how I write in the citations, but move the comma so it is Jun 28, 2018 or Jun 2018. I will change MOS.--MEcfsFMS (talk) 14:43, 31 October 2018 (EDT)

- Will do, do you know about fixing the citation template error at all? Dates generated in the form 2018-06 always give an error when you generate a citation from a link - I presume it's possible to fix this? notjusttired (talk) 14:49, 31 October 2018 (EDT)

## Fibromyaliga Page

Please be careful where information is added on the Fibromyalgia page. The blood test information you added should go on the Fibromyalgia notable studies page as it is not an accepted blood test yet. I moved the EpicGenetics blood test under the subheading "Blood tests" under "United States" and put the study you had added on the Fibromyalgia discussion page. You can post this research on the Fibromyalgia notable studies page.

I created and edited most of these pages starting with the username DxCFS. I lost my PW when FF crashed and could not get it back using the PW retrieval as there is something wrong with MEpedia carrying out this task. I have had many usernames because I am really bad with remembering my usernames and usually just use a VPN now.--77.111.245.10 12:07, 25 March 2019 (EDT)

Also, the Fibromyalgia page became too long to use the "Edit" tab and the "Edit source" tab is not an option due to citations and that is why I broke Notable studies off. There is an area at the bottom of the Fibromyalgia page to post news articles about research as people usually want to read about research by media and bloggers and not the hard research.--77.111.245.10 12:13, 25 March 2019 (EDT)
Thanks for the input - I've never edited that page before. I will update the redirects for blood test info - when I searched before adding it the Fibro Notable studies page wasn't near the top of the results (I don't recall seeing it at all). notjusttired (talk) 16:49, 25 March 2019 (EDT)

## Simon Wessely Page

content hidden

Wessely Page - Hi Notjusttired. I'm currently editing the page on Simon Wessely by inserting many references. Please leave the page for a moment otherwise we crosspost and I loose all the changes which is many hours of work. Kind regards, Sisyphus.

I've just seen your notice. I will leave alone. I am going to put some improved citations on the talk page and leave it at that. notjusttired (talk) 08:08, July 16, 2019 (EDT)

Thanks. It's ok now. The references have been inserted (It took a while). Could you delete the warning "This article may require cleanup to meet MEpedia's quality standards"? If not, could you explain which sections or claims you disagree with (for example in the discussion section of the page). Kind regards, Sisyphus.

I will take a look. Did you see the citations I suggested on the talk page, including the Camelford ones? notjusttired (talk) 10:45, July 16, 2019 (EDT)

I used some of them. I only briefly mention Camelford as an example where Wessely controversially pointed towards psychosocial factors in a case that isn't clear. More information about this could be posted on a seperate MEpedia page. I unfortunately do not know the details of this case, so I'll leave it to you and others. - Sisypus.

User:Sisyphus Can you explain why so many sections have been removed or pretty much reverted? It was only recently changed about 3 weeks ago. It now reads as if everything Wessely claims via journalists or is in his research is a fact - even though at times he contradicts his previous statements so making it hard to know what he thinks. Eg the fact that Wessely claims CFS is part of MUS is his opinion, not a generally accept fact and that needs to be clear. In fact, one of the controversies around Wessely is him repeatedly making the claim that it can be classed as a psychological condition in the ICD-10 manual - despite confirmation from the World Health Organization that it is explicitly excluded and only classified as neurological. Including the death threats. The carefully phrased sections I added about those contesting his many claims are gone. He is known for saying one thing to one audience and something totally different to another. The links to the 3 pages of quotes complied from him are gone. I haven't seen a reason in the history or a mention of the removals or changes to the headings. Even his retirement claim is not a fact - he carried on publishing CFS research for years after "retiring". Eg police freedom of information act requests contradict that. As far as Wessely's claims of victimization go, we should be reporting "In a 2017 interview, Wessely stated that" but not in a way that suggests that it is factual. Wessely refused to appear before the UK's Gibson Enquiry which was pressing him for answers on his views. notjusttired (talk) 11:59, July 17, 2019 (EDT)

I'm happy to have the quotes back under a heading "Quotes critical of Wessely" or similar. The classification of ME/CFS is a huge issue because it is part of his claims that it is not a disease / has no disease process and that it is psychological or mostly psychological which justifies the CBT and even GET. He refuses to acknowledge any science he does not like such as mitochondria or immune days. It's quite likely he quit research rather than having his work proved wrong. Same with Michael Sharpe, also from the PACE trial. Peter White of the PACE trial allegedly retired early from clinical practice to avoid GMC complaints that could have removed his license to practice (he was under investigation). Wessely also helped design the PACE trial - a crucial fact now missing from the top of his page. Wessely and his policies largely in control of UK treatment and has been for over a decade. Regular political questions on him and his Wessely school. Thanks to his attempts to re-classify the illness all UK ME/CFS treatment comes from a mental health health budget, he controls the media via the Science Media Centre, and gives numerous interviews making nasty persons attacks on patients. Wessely and Deale provided the key randomized controlled trial in the 1990s still used as "evidence" for CBT. The Gibson Enquiry was a scientific one, many years before he stated his death threat claims - which some have suggested are simply a way to detect from PACE trial criticism, since that's when they appeared. Absolutely nothing to fear from that except scientific scrutiny. Several Freedom of Information Act requests have shown that PACE trial critics are not harassing let alone threatening anyone. Although they tried to use this argument to prevent the release of the data.

I feel that the page re-write portrays Wessely incorrectly as mostly not controversial, and portrays his science as student accepted, and endorses his views given in newspaper interviews as accurate and unbiased. He will make claims like Gulf War Illness doesn't exist, then later claim to have originally discovered it! He's also a social security advisor and does not believe patients should be entitled to disability benefits.As regards the quotes - they come from several charities and are certainly not taken out of context. It's very hard to see how many of the statements could be out of context given how rude and nasty they often are about patients, who he calls "disgusting" and "not wanting to get better".
What do you think about adding back in the references that were removed, and then working together to tackle a section at once? I think it important to be very careful not to claim Wessely has reported the truth about himself since this is often untrue or contradicted (either by himself or by independent sources). notjusttired (talk) 13:35, July 17, 2019 (EDT)

I have thought about your comments but I think we have to be neutral and objective on this. I don’t think the texts of Margaret Williams and Malcolm Hooper should be used as a basis for the MEpedia page for exactly this reason. The page already contains much criticism of Wessely. It says in the introduction that his work is controversial and has been repeatedly criticized and it already contains numerous controversial quotes of him (including the “not wanting to get better” one). Regarding the quotes out of context: I do think this is a big problem. The one about ME merely being a belief for example has been circulating within the ME community as it were to mean that ME patients are malingering, which isn’t what Wessely was saying. These kinds of misunderstandings are very unfortunate and distract from the real issues with his work. I also think the MEpedia page should not only be directed towards patients but also to outsiders such as journalists or researchers who want objective information about Wessely. So a link to a list of controversial quotes with comments mocking what he said seems inappropriate. There are plenty of blogs and articles that criticize his work or scrutinize every word he said during his career, looking for inconsistencies or poorly nuanced statements. I don’t think the MEpedia page should be another of these and instead should offer an overview of his work and career like we do with other pages on researchers. If you see further problems with the page, I don’t mind discussing it further. But I think the current version is well balanced. - Sisyphus.

I think the issue we are disagreeing on here is mostly neutrality. While parts of the previous page were not put across in a way that was fully neutrally totally excluding critical sources has in fact done the opposite. We can look at phrasing at the amount of text given to criticism but removing it is entirely inappropriate. I have an issue with passing off Wessely's views as facts when they are not - such as claiming CFS is part of MUS. We should not be doing that on any researcher's page. There is no doubt that Wessely is controversial - in fact he has given a number of interviews knowing that they would be controversial. "Controversial" is not a negative judgement - the Enterovirus theory is also controversial. ME itself and much of the research is controversial. The fact is his research is controversial too - after all the CDC, NHS and others followed it and the CDC and others then dumped it, plus there was the Stop GET petition too. The Institute of Medicine report disputes it. On neurality, we also can't claim Wessely invented CBT for CFS when he actually was one of 3 - Trudie Chalder has separately claimed to be the inventer. I am going to make some edits today, keeping in mind what you have said, to add in more neutral phrasing on his research "Wessely stated", in "Sir Wessely's view" etc. And add back in some references critical. While Margaret Williams and Malcolm Hooper are very critical, that does not mean they should be totally left off the page - that's not neutrality - but neither should they be emphasized. Patient groups critical of Wessely should certainly be referenced, along with Freedom of Information Act requests since they are neutral and accurate. This might mean overall that less text is critical of Wessely than before, but that there are a large number of sources supporting certain points. Part of the guidelines we are writing for is to allow others to find out more information, so we do need to either reference or link to quotes or Hooper's Mental health movement, but also any articles praising him and summarizing his contribution. If Quotes aren't used as a heading then they could go in Learn more for example. Clearly given the significant time taken to collect all these, they do have significance and may bring people to do the page who are looking for "Weasel words" - in which case they would then see an article more balanced than just those quotes. Perhaps you would like to look for those, or have some in mind. Re: Malingering: Wessely has said exactly that, in fact using the phrase "malinger's charter". Part of the basis of his scientific arguments is that around the "secondary gain" - his work and especially interviews repeatedly make this claim. That doesn't necessarily mean that particular quote needs including, but it is representative of his views. notjusttired (talk) 07:12, July 18, 2019 (EDT)

"CBT is is based on a psychological and fatigue-based approach, with an expectation that exercise would normally be part of the treatment." is also not correct. In contrast to the CBT developed by Bleijenberg and Vercoulen, the CBT model developed at Kings' College does not necessarily include exercise. Instead it is focussed on graded actvity which can be increases in social activities, reading etc. Furthermore it is strange to describe it as a fatigue-based approach as it was inspired by the treatment of chronic pain. Wessely and other CBT-authors acknowledge this repeatedly.

Do you mind if I move this conversion to the Talk page for Wessely? We are getting into what feels like a stalemate, I think input and suggestions from others would help. There shouldn't be a question on authority here, I would like to achieve a consensus and that should be possible. One of the very difficult issues with Wessely is that he contradicts himself, and these are worth pointing out. He will claim one thing in one place and another to a different audience - "malinger's charter" is a direct quote from him which he later contradicted (just as an example). So we should be careful in claiming his view or one thing or another when he himself has contradicted it elsewhere. The new section I will respond on in a moment, with a paste from the research to clarify.
I recognize you have worked hard on this, but I think to make huge changes at all once causes issues for other editors. I also have worked extensively in this page, in Nov/Dec, and in March and then in June, plus on related topics recently - eg CBM model, and CBT. I too would prefer a revert to before you made the changes (!) but I think a looking towards a consensus would be a better approach. notjusttired (talk) 09:20, July 18, 2019 (EDT)

Yes perhaps it's best to move the conversion to the talk page for Wessely. Perhaps we can just copy paste what we wrote here so that others can follow our conversation? I also agree in working towards a consensus. But changes need to be carefully argued with good references (not just something someone else has claimed on a blog or tweet). I haven't seen any evidence that Wessely often contradicts himself, excepts perhaps for his statements on not seeing Ean P. Of course if one dissects everything a researcher has said or published in the last 30 years, you'll always find something. But haven't noticed clear contradictions. I'm not aware however where the 'malinger's charter' quote comes from - was this during a lecture? One option would be to add more detailed criticism and information about Wessely on a seperate page - for example 'Wessely school' and to add a prominent link on the Simon Wessely page to this one for further details on the criticism of his work, including what Hooper and Williams have written. I apologize if I deleted information you saw as important. I tried to incorporate most in the text I've wrote. I appreciate the hard work you put into MEpedia.

## Tagging -- Brettz9 (talk) 16:06, July 23, 2019 (EDT)

Hi there... I'm really too drained and preoccupied to do much these days with the wiki, so if you wouldn't mind only tagging me in cases where I had added the content myself, I'd appreciate it. Thanks! Brettz9 (talk) 16:06, July 23, 2019 (EDT)

Sure notjusttired (talk) 16:41, July 23, 2019 (EDT)

## Slow down

Please slow down with your edits on Dutch topics. You're making lots of mistakes. As I suffer from ME, I can't possibly keep up. Guido den Broeder (talk) 21:24, September 12, 2019 (EDT)

I can slow down editing, although I have no yet seen evidence that I had said anything not supported by references notjusttired (talk) 13:18, September 13, 2019 (EDT)

I am now asking you to stay away from the Dutch pages that I'm editing. If you don't do that voluntarily, I will ask for you to be topic-banned. Guido den Broeder (talk) 17:25, September 14, 2019 (EDT)

Explain your reason please. There are several editors reversing your edits, you are not following editorial or science guidelines, and even reversing some manual of style changes at the same time (eg date format). And you have a clear conflict of interest with this topic because you are founder one Dutch charity and wrote here - on MEpedia - that you previously lead a revolt against changes in another. So I find this request of yours quite unexpected. notjusttired (talk) 20:03, September 14, 2019 (EDT)
This is not Wikipedia. Conflict of interest is not even defined here. If we were to apply the Wikipedia policy I would have a conflict of interest with every topic on this wiki, and so would all knowledgable editors, and the wiki would remain empty. So instead we just do the best we can, because it's important and there are only a few of us. All that you contribute on these pages is a lot of mistakes. That costs too much of my time and energy, so it needs to stop. There is plenty of technical work to do, so why don't you do that and leave the content to others. Guido den Broeder (talk) 20:27, September 14, 2019 (EDT)
With regard to dates: when I'm creating an article, I avoid using citation templates, because those clutter up the source text so badly that my ME brain can't cope very well. So the date format is irrelevant and I use the same format that I apply everywhere else, again saving time and energy. Content is important, minor differences in style are not. Guido den Broeder (talk) 20:51, September 14, 2019 (EDT)
So basically, you don't have a reason other than "mistakes". Please see the MEpedia:Manual of style including the talk page for it on dates. Everything here is US format, with short month names. It is up to you whether you use the Visual editor or not, but it would create ask the citations for you very quickly. Alternatively, just paste in the link as you do now, without the [ ]square brackets , then when you next use the Visual editor click it, and you will get a "Convert" option which will do so the citation for you. The citation template is not optional - but we are always keen to find ways to reduce the concentration needed to edit or read. I am somewhat surprised that you have not edited your own charity page now (I was on the website earlier but can't find some of the standard info we normally add). Brain fog I can never get used to. notjusttired (talk) 21:31, September 14, 2019 (EDT)

Section headers should not auto-generate a signature in them. Not only does that makes things messy, it affects Google searches. Can you please change that back to default? Guido den Broeder (talk) 16:34, September 15, 2019 (EDT)

This is an automatic feature on MEpedia for editors using the toolbar button. There is no option not to include the name and signature. If you want this to change you need find out how it works and request the change, although it may have been added because inexperienced editors were forgetting to sign their posts. MEpedia talk pages are not indexed. notjusttired (talk) 17:45, September 15, 2019 (EDT)
Not so much inexperienced editors, but you do forget to sign your posts. Apparently, despite offering technical help, you don't have access to the backside of this wiki. That's OK, I will ask elsewhere. Could you explain what your offer of technical assistance means instead? Guido den Broeder (talk) 17:55, September 15, 2019 (EDT)

## Manual of style

The Manual of style was in part created by editors that are no longer around, with random edits by you in between. I intend to change it to make it easier for ME patients to contribute, before inviting other ME patients to join this project. For now, just remember that the MoS is not mandatory, especially not on pages that are still work in progress. They are guidance, not policy. Allowing users to contribute in a style that they feel comfortable with has priority. Guido den Broeder (talk) 17:36, September 15, 2019 (EDT)

That is a ridiculous statement. I hope that you did not mean to suggest that the ill health of editors should be used to disregard their views and contributions entirely. It would appear that you have total disdain for the current MOS, editorial guidelines and science guidelines, and the fact that we have over 2,000 pages following these. Repeated uncivil behavior toward several users is also apparent. As I understand from your message here and your repeated failure to follow what has been agreed, you appear to have chosen not to engage with the process and feel that you will just change them as how you choose and without discussion. This is a collaborate project rather than a website you can simply hijack. notjusttired (talk) 17:57, September 15, 2019 (EDT)

## Guido den Broeder

I refuse to accept further messages from you on my talk page. You are repeatedly harassing me and edit warring, and at times insulting me. This is not civil behavior.

In future, if you have something to say to me use the relevant article talk page instead. User:Guido den Broeder notjusttired (talk) 17:57, September 15, 2019 (EDT)

## Dorsal root ganglion or Dorsal root ganglia -- Loopy (talk) 08:51, November 18, 2019 (EST)

Hi, Notjusttired.

I wanted to ask if you felt that the Dorsal root ganglia page should really be Dorsal root ganglion. I see it both ways but usually Dorsal root ganglion. Wikipedia has a page that uses "ganglion". https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dorsal_root_ganglion

--Loopy (talk) 08:51, November 18, 2019 (EST)

I'm not really sure to be honest. If you want to rename it, leave the old redirect in place in case anyone searches for the old name. The wiki reference (ref 1) should be replaced with an encyclopedia or similar to meet the Science guidelines. ~Njt (talk) 13:19, November 18, 2019 (EST)

## Edit Issues? -- Loopy (talk) 05:14, April 17, 2020 (PDT)

I am having problems with editing. Only "Edit source" will let me edit, and even this option does not seem to be working well. And suddenly my FF browser will not let me edit here due to it not being an HTTPS site? Are you having problems? Trying to use the "Edit" tab, but keep getting the error "Error loading data from server: apierror-visualeditor-docserver-http-error: (curl error: 7) Couldn't connect to server. Would you like to retry?"

Hi there. I think we are all getting the same - it's been raised with the developers since it only started after they did a migration. I found that using https allowed editing in the source code, eg https://www.me-pedia.org/wiki/Coronavirus_disease_19 - but it keeps flipping back to http and thinking I am not logged out, so I end up typing https over the top of the address again. This also means we can't get the visual editor to convert links into full references like normal. I am also having issues with editing categories at the bottom of pages - it seems to work but when you go to the category directly, it isn't getting updated (I have moved several pages from the Infectious agents to Infectious diseases categories). I am not sure if others are getting this too. Ben from MEAction is talking with the developers on this. Btw: it should let you edit most pages with http but still show up as an anonymous edit, pages with some protection eg the primers or CFS page soupy need you to log in (and use https). It's very frustrating. ~Njt (talk) 12:09, April 17, 2020 (PDT)

chronic fatigue syndrome (CFS) - A fatigue-based illness. The term CFS was invented invented by the U.S. Centers for Disease Control as an replacement for myalgic encephalomyelitis (ME). Some view CFS as a neurological disease, others use the term for any unexplained long-term fatigue. Sometimes used as a the term as a synonym of myalgic encephalomyelitis, despite the different diagnostic criteria.

PACE trial - A controversial study which claimed that CBT and GET were effective in treating "CFS/ME", despite the fact that its own data did not support this conclusion. Its results and methodology were widely disputed by patients, scientists, and the peer-reviewed scientific literature.

myalgic encephalomyelitis (ME) - A disease often marked by neurological symptoms, but fatigue is sometimes a symptom as well. Some diagnostic criteria distinguish it from chronic fatigue syndrome, while other diagnostic criteria consider it to be a synonym for chronic fatigue syndrome. A defining characteristic of ME is post-exertional malaise (PEM), or post-exertional neuroimmune exhaustion (PENE), which is a notable exacerbation of symptoms brought on by small exertions. PEM can last for days or weeks. Symptoms can include cognitive impairments, muscle pain (myalgia), trouble remaining upright (orthostatic intolerance), sleep abnormalities, and gastro-intestinal impairments, among others. An estimated 25% of those suffering from ME are housebound or bedbound. The World Health Organization (WHO) classifies ME as a neurological disease.

International Consensus Criteria (ICC) - A set of diagnostic criteria, based on the Canadian Consensus Criteria, that argued for the abandonment of the term "chronic fatigue syndrome" and encouraged the sole use of the term "myalgic encephalomyelitis".

chronic fatigue syndrome (CFS) - A fatigue-based illness. The term CFS was invented invented by the U.S. Centers for Disease Control as an replacement for myalgic encephalomyelitis (ME). Some view CFS as a neurological disease, others use the term for any unexplained long-term fatigue. Sometimes used as a the term as a synonym of myalgic encephalomyelitis, despite the different diagnostic criteria.

post-exertional malaise (PEM) - A notable exacerbation of symptoms brought on by small physical or cognitive exertions. PEM can last for days or weeks. Symptoms can include cognitive impairments, muscle pain (myalgia), trouble remaining upright (orthostatic intolerance), sleep abnormalities, and gastro-intestinal impairments, among others.

myalgia - Muscle pain.

medically unexplained physical symptoms (MUPS) - Technically, this term means that no cause or explanation for the patient's symptoms has yet been found. However, patients diagnosed with "MUPS" are generally lumped into a psychosomatic, or psychologically-caused category by those in the medical profession, without any scientific basis for doing so.

International Classification of Diseases (ICD) - A system of medical diagnostic codes, created by the World Health Organization (WHO), to classify diseases and other health related conditions for the purpose of international diagnostic consistency. By having common diagnostic codes around the world, health researchers are better able to quantify and track disease burdens. The most current version is called ICD-11. (Learn more: www.who.int)

World Health Organization (WHO) - "A specialized agency of the United Nations that is concerned with public health. It was established on 7 April 1948, and is headquartered in Geneva, Switzerland. The WHO is a member of the United Nations Development Group. Its predecessor, the Health Organization, was an agency of the League of Nations." The International Statistical Classification of Diseases and Related Health Problems (ICD) is maintained by WHO. (Learn more: en.wikipedia.org)

International Classification of Diseases (ICD) - A system of medical diagnostic codes, created by the World Health Organization (WHO), to classify diseases and other health related conditions for the purpose of international diagnostic consistency. By having common diagnostic codes around the world, health researchers are better able to quantify and track disease burdens. The most current version is called ICD-11. (Learn more: www.who.int)

cognitive behavioral therapy (CBT) - A type of psychotherapy geared toward modifying alleged unhealthy thinking, behaviors or illness beliefs. One of the treatment arms used in the controversial PACE trial.

graded exercise therapy (GET) - A gradual increase in exercise or activity, according to a pre-defined plan. Focuses on overcoming the patient's alleged unhelpful illness beliefs that exertion can exacerbate symptoms, rather than on reversing physical deconditioning. Considered controversial, and possibly harmful, in the treatment or management of ME. One of the treatment arms of the controversial PACE trial.

mitochondria - Important parts of the biological cell, with each mitochondrion encased within a mitochondrial membrane. Mitochondria are best known for their role in energy production, earning them the nickname "the powerhouse of the cell". Mitochondria also participate in the detection of threats and the response to these threats. One of the responses to threats orchestrated by mitochondria is apoptosis, a cell suicide program used by cells when the threat can not be eliminated.

randomized controlled trial (RCT) - A trial in which participants are randomly assigned to two groups, with one group receiving the treatment being studied and a control or comparison group receiving a sham treatment, placebo, or comparison treatment.

enterovirus - A genus of RNA viruses which typically enter the body through the respiratory or gastrointestinal systems and sometimes spread to the central nervous system or other parts of the body, causing neurological, cardiac, and other damage. Since the first reports of myalgic encephalomyelitis (ME), enteroviruses have been suspected as a cause of ME. Enteroviruses have also been implicated as the cause of Type I diabetes, congestive heart failure, and other conditions. Enteroviruses include poliovirus, coxsackieviruses, and many others. New enteroviruses and new strains of existing enteroviruses are continuously being discovered. (Learn more: viralzone.expasy.org)

Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) - The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention is a U.S. government agency dedicated to epidemiology and public health. It operates under the auspices of the Department of Health and Human Services.

Institute of Medicine report (IOM report) - A report that was commissioned by the U.S. government and was published by the Institute of Medicine on February 10, 2015. The report was titled "Beyond Myalgic Encephalomyelitis/Chronic Fatigue Syndrome: Redefining an Illness" and proposed the term Systemic Exertion Intolerance Disease (SEID). Among its key findings were that "This disease is characterized by profound fatigue, cognitive dysfunction, sleep abnormalities, autonomic manifestations, pain, and other symptoms that are made worse by exertion of any sort." The report further stated "Between 836,000 and 2.5 million Americans suffer from myalgic encephalomyelitis/chronic fatigue syndrome."

myalgic encephalomyelitis (ME) - A disease often marked by neurological symptoms, but fatigue is sometimes a symptom as well. Some diagnostic criteria distinguish it from chronic fatigue syndrome, while other diagnostic criteria consider it to be a synonym for chronic fatigue syndrome. A defining characteristic of ME is post-exertional malaise (PEM), or post-exertional neuroimmune exhaustion (PENE), which is a notable exacerbation of symptoms brought on by small exertions. PEM can last for days or weeks. Symptoms can include cognitive impairments, muscle pain (myalgia), trouble remaining upright (orthostatic intolerance), sleep abnormalities, and gastro-intestinal impairments, among others. An estimated 25% of those suffering from ME are housebound or bedbound. The World Health Organization (WHO) classifies ME as a neurological disease.

The information provided at this site is not intended to diagnose or treat any illness.
From MEpedia, a crowd-sourced encyclopedia of ME and CFS science and history.